TN TN: All five Clos St. Jacques 2017

Discussion in 'UK Wine Forum' started by Mark Carrington, Jul 26, 2020.

  1. 67 Pall Mall event. Logistics were tricky as I was travelling, but Jasper bailed me out by accepting my consignment.
    Made the effort to visit the vineyard (it's tucked away) during the afternoon, to set the mood.

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    Tasted in order, right to left aka north to south.

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    Overall impression is that the vineyard merits its grand reputation but I have no issue with current status of 1er cru, with due care & attention taken by each producer (as explained by JM, there are other occasional releases).. Esmonin & Jadot true to their house style. I'm a much less familiar with the other three, in particular Rousseau, unsurprisingly - I checked out the price of the latter, even higher than I anticipated.
    • 2017 Sylvie Esmonin (Michel et Fille) Gevrey-Chambertin 1er Cru Clos St. Jacques - France, Burgundy, Côte de Nuits, Gevrey-Chambertin 1er Cru (26/07/2020)
      Mauve tinged; some oak on 'moderne' nose; ripe, supple, integrated. A clunky feel to spicy finish, needs plenty of time. (92 pts.)
    • 2017 Domaine Bruno Clair Gevrey-Chambertin 1er Cru Clos St. Jacques - France, Burgundy, Côte de Nuits, Gevrey-Chambertin 1er Cru (26/07/2020)
      Very pale; an attractive melange of earthiness & fragrance; soft entry to palate, crisp acidity, elegant, expansive fruit. Well balanced. Deepens with air & tannins move to fore. (93 pts.)
    • 2017 Louis Jadot Gevrey-Chambertin 1er Cru Clos St. Jacques - France, Burgundy, Côte de Nuits, Gevrey-Chambertin 1er Cru (26/07/2020)
      Very pale, brighter; fragrant, lifted (touch of acetone); (more) depth & power, crisp acidity, muscular; spicy finish - has a blunt edge. (92 pts.)
    • 2017 Domaine Fourrier Gevrey-Chambertin 1er Cru Clos St. Jacques Vieille Vigne - France, Burgundy, Côte de Nuits, Gevrey-Chambertin 1er Cru (26/07/2020)
      Mid colour; meaty, has a substance to its bouquet, blossoms with air - a lifted element; bold dark fruit, latent power, weighty. This carries through to an extended finish, tad burly. Merits more time. (93 pts.).
    • 2017 Domaine Armand Rousseau Père et Fils Gevrey-Chambertin 1er Cru Clos St. Jacques - France, Burgundy, Côte de Nuits, Gevrey-Chambertin 1er Cru (26/07/2020)
      V. Pale; expansive bouquet, lovely pure red fruit; a core of beautiful fruit & structure, polished, classy panache & focus. Lingering. (96 pts.)
    Posted from CellarTracker

      • This was not cheap event, but as justified to Mrs C, this was effectively once in a lifetime opportunity for me to taste them side by side. Jasper provided a clearsighted context.
        Participants have two votes & surprisingly not everyone chose the Rousseau. Then again, thankfully, there is a wide difference in preferences when it comes to wine.

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        We had dinner beforehand & I took the opportunity to open a CSJ with some age.
        • 2007 Sylvie Esmonin (Michel et Fille) Gevrey-Chambertin 1er Cru Clos St. Jacques - France, Burgundy, Côte de Nuits, Gevrey-Chambertin 1er Cru (26/07/2020)
          Deep core; oomph on nose, black fruits to the fore; easier going on the palate, but has some density. Can be enjoyed now & Next decade. (93 pts.)
        Posted from CellarTracker
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2020
  2. It has been quite some time since I have drunk the Rousseau though I have drunk more than a few in the past. My impression used to be that it was a complete outlier in the appellation though that may have changed, and that the winemaking signature took strong precedence over terroir expression, if that is a legitimate concept.
    Where I did gradually get to was that the Clos St Jacques isn't by any means my favourite Gevrey premier cru though I of course understand the reason for its preeminence.
     
  3. Mark,
    Looks great tasting... I love the colour differences.... and your ranking/preference was?

    Tom,

    Producer typicity can also be said of S Esmonin and Fourrier...( I have not tasted the others yet except a Rousseau 2007 in a restaurant in Lyon a few years ago for less than 200 euros...cheaper then WS at the time...)
    I managed to purchase/cellar the 5 CSJ 2010 (the Rousseau is the only Rousseau I ever purchased...), so I expect to organise something in a few years time to get through the lot. I suppose I have to wait another 5 to 10 years...
    No chance to rebuy any CSJ horizontal given current prices...
     
    Gareth Powell likes this.
  4. Of all of them, of course, it is certainly a woolly notion.
     
  5. Could you please share your notes/rating of the Bruno Clair?
    TIA,
    Alex R.
     
  6. That Esmonin looks more like a young Rhone Mark :p
     
    Mark Carrington likes this.
  7. Thanks for the notes Mark, I wanted the wines for this tasting but there was some undisclosed issue with the wines, I got notice they were with UPS then the next day got a unexplained note saying the wines couldn’t be supplied, maybe an accident in transit ? Either way I did watch the tasting enviously and found it very interesting
     
  8. Duly added & the correct note for SE '17 added.

    I had the same, but it was part of the process to switch destinations & arrived safe & sound.
    Not entirely convinced by the green credentials of the new packaging, but on this occasion it work well. The temperature here was 30C+, so used fridge & then the polystyrene maintain an equitable temperature.
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2020
  9. Re the packing - ive had one with the older packing, which showed three reds (or pink) on the white mini bottle, and two with the mega packing the first showed no indication of heat and one which showed two pinks. All of which opened on receipt.

    So Im not totally convinced - thats a lot of insulation to throw at six tiny bottles.

    Two more packs un opened but stored in the cool room.

    Back on track the only Clos St Jaques Ive had has been Jadot’s version, nice wine but Im not sure for me its worth the premium over some of their other Gevrey 1ers (or indeed their Vosne 1ers)!
     
  10. I try and buy the Clair and Rousseau every year. Managed to get a bottle each of the ‘18. The Rousseau is twice the price of the Clair, but immediately doubles in asking price. A big difference, but the Chambertin, Clos de Beze and other Grand Crus appreciate by more. Can’t say that it make the Clos St Jacques looks a bargain, but that 1er classification does make a difference.
     
  11. I think I have just one bottle of the Rousseau 2015...
    Coincidentally I just happened to come across my copy of the Adnams list for 1993 - I think they were offering a total of 17 Rousseau wines, the most expensive a Chambertin for a bit under £60. If only I'd had a few hundred pounds to spare!
     
  12. We don't get too many tasting notes on Rousseau anymore on the forum which is a bit of a shame.
     
  13. Mike , don’t ! Such a shame to see the fall of Adnams, who don’t take wine that seriously anymore.
     
  14. Would it be fair to say that each Domaine owns sub-parcels within the main clos?

    So while instructive isn't it fair to say the differences aren't just Domaine (vinification) specific in origin?
     
  15. They do, Steve, but they’re all parallel strips running from top to bottom, and thus having similar changes in slope, soil etc.
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2020
  16. As Simon states.
    Jasper maintains that the terroir is effectively identical across the five.
    Unlike Clos de Vougeot. :rolleyes:
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2020
    Steven Pritchard likes this.
  17. Well, I did have a glass of Rousseau's Charmes-Chambertin 1998 just over a week ago. It was a very good wine strongly marked by the character of the 1998 vintage and much more ferrous and darker-fruited than Rousseau usually is. More structure than usual too for Charmes-Chambertin, with just a hint of dryness towards the finish. No detailed notes taken, but probably a ***1/2 star wine at full maturity (although it would keep for some time at this level of course). I increasingly find that there is a family relationship between 1995 and 1998, the latter being my preference every time.
     
    Alex Jagger likes this.
  18. Fractional differences in that Rousseau has more of the bottom part of which Bruno and Sylive have none. But to all intents and purposes CSJ is unusually uniform by Burgundy standards.
     
  19. Both excellent vintages. 98 is generally more approachable now but will I suspect be less long lasting. On the other hand Rousseau's 95s were a stunning success which cannot be said of his 98s.
     
    Richard Zambuni likes this.
  20. Which amazes even more that Esmonin’s trades at such a discount to the others. Such is the power of brand. ie Rousseau.
     
  21. How much of the differences between the producers is down to farming and how much down to wine-making? I am sure each grower will claim that it is all about the work done on the vineyard rather than in the winery, yet is this just spiel? If it is mainly down to viticulture, then I wonder what Rousseau is doing that the others are not?
     
    Last edited: Jul 27, 2020
  22. The difference in colours is fascinating. From S Esmonin purple colour to Rousseau very light red (with even some orange?). What can explain such big differences? Still pinot noir, same climate, could wood have an impact?
    Could you feel a wood impact? The wines are young and I think both Rousseau and Esmonin are 100% new wood (or at least were as I am unaware of change) while Fourrier is only 20% new wood and no stems
     
  23. Cold soak/no cold soak, fermentation period, temperature of the fermentation to name a few parameters Antoine.
     
  24. Is it the case that Sylvie Esmonin could make her wine taste like Rousseau, but chooses not to? Or is there some secret, or difficult technique, to Rousseau's winemaking that makes it hard to imitate?
     
  25. Does Rousseau have a "recipe" ;) ?
     

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